[Bioconversion] Re: [Stoves] Re: Sunchokes tubers (Jerusalem Artichokes)

[Harmon Seaver]

    First off, I'd like to ask that this conversation migrate to its
proper home, which is bioconversion, not stoves.
    I'm not sure about the feasibility of JA as ethanol feedstock, we
grew them as food, and loved them -- had no problems with digestive
upset as some have reported here, but then we always ate a lot of
veggies, beans, fiber, etc. Those who are primarily meat eaters often
have problems with various vegetables.
    At any rate, one thing I noticed very quickly, that although it
was easy to "replant" the crop, after harvesting the bigger tubers, by
simply rototilling the area, the deer were the dtermining factor in
crop production. Once the local deer population found my JA patch,
they came in immediately after the first frost and ate the whole thing
right  down to the ground. So, in northern MN, we could only get one
crop total, but then the future crops were smaller and smaller due to
the deer. What I had thought was going to be a super food/energy crop
turned out to be mostly a great deer lure. So I put up a deer stand
next to the field.  8-)
     I no longer hunt, so that's not a draw anymore.
   Anyway -- what is a very viable energy crop, worldwide, which is
not being utilized, is cattails. Cattails contain 40% starch in their
roots, and, even in MN, where years of research have been done on
cattails as an energy crop at the Univ. of MN, you can get 28 dry tons
per acre of the roots without replanting, without any fertilizer
input, without any pesticide use.
    What is really great about cattails in the midwest US as well is
that a great deal of our farmland is really drained wetlands. Driving
around, in Spring time, you will see gazillions of acres under water.
These are farm fields that have been fitted with drain tiles to allow
them to be farmed for crops like corn -- imagine what you could do if
you simply quit fighting mother nature and ripped out those drain
tiles, filled those drainage ditches and planted cattails instead.
     Cattails right now are considered an invasive species (even
though they are native) because they spread so fast and are so tough
to kill. State natural resource departments spend litterly millions of
dollars each year to eradicate cattails.
     Duh!


On 4/24/06, Roger Samson <rsamson at reap-canada.com> wrote:
> Tom and all
>
> It seems that broadleaf field crops can't come close to competing with
> perennial warm season grass like sugar cane as an energy production system.
> I think the Brazilians are saying they are competitive with oil at
> $35/barrel. The Brazilian situation is ideal, they have an effective
> research and development program for cane, infrastructure and technical and
> management capacity to run plants. The problem is that many of the poorest
> countries have the least R and D capabilities, worst infrastructure and weak
> technical capacity and management. It has to be a step by step approach at
> building up the industry in these countries. Perhaps countries can import
> ethanol and stoves to get experience.
>
> Cellulosic ethanol from drought tolerant species like erianthus could
> compete on marginal farmlands in the tropics if cellulosic ethanol
> technology achieves what is projected in terms of yields and costs.
>
> In the long run, ethanol will be most competitive where cheap sugar and
> cheap biomass can be produced. Industrialized countries should invest in
> plants in the tropics to secure their future liquid fuels supplies. They can
> focus on solid fuels which are less energy dense. Shipping long distances
> with liquid fuels is more economically possible than solid fuels. Neither
> Europe or north America has the farmland area to meet all their energy
> needs, they should focus on what can they do best to reduce their demand for
> fossil fuels and support partnerships in developing nations to access their
> liquid fuels.
>
> Roger Samson
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: stoves-bounces at listserv.repp.org
> [mailto:stoves-bounces at listserv.repp.org] On Behalf Of Tom Miles
> Sent: Monday, April 24, 2006 5:04 PM
> To: STOVES at listserv.repp.org
> Subject: RE: [Stoves] Re: Sunchokes tubers (Jerusalem Artichokes)
>
> Roger,
>
> I think the lesson is that developing special crops like jerusalem
> artichokes for conversion to liquid fuels can be costly in many ways.
>
> The advantages of alcohol for cooking and light are demonstrated by the work
> of Project Gaia in Africa and NARI in India.
>
> Can alcohol fuels be produced and delivered affordably within the existing
> infrastructure of developing regions? Or is a major policy committment
> needed on national and regional levels to provide these fuels for cooking,
> light and health?
>
> I would think that it would be very site specific depending on the
> suitability of crops, like sugar and sweet sorghum, that can take advantage
> of existing plants and equipment or on the availablity of fossil derived
> alcohols.
>
> Tom
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: stoves-bounces at listserv.repp.org
> [mailto:stoves-bounces at listserv.repp.org] On Behalf Of Roger Samson
> Sent: Monday, April 24, 2006 12:29 PM
> To: 'Tom Miles'; frank at compostlab.com; 'Boll, Martin Dr.';
> STOVES at listserv.repp.org
> Subject: RE: [Stoves] Re: Sunchokes tubers (Jerusalem Artichokes)
>
>
> Tom
>
> Somebody should write a book on the corn ethanol circus today. Subsidize the
> farmer, subsidize the ethanol and let the environment subsidize the
> pollution while the fossil energy industry and big agribusiness laugh all
> the way to the bank.
>
> Maybe you could title it corn ethanol: A step by step guide into turning
> taxpayers money into your money
>
> Roger
>
>
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--
Harmon Seaver