[Gasification] Producer Gas Driven Engine w/ Liquid Fuel Assist

[Ken Basterfield]

Sorry Mike,
Not treading on toes, I just enjoy doing a rough calculation based on the
bits of knowledge I have.
40 years ago, being converted from Imperial units of measure to MKS, now SI,
I would enjoy the mental exercise of a calculation in one system of units
with a reverse calculation in the other! We were short of money for any
other sort of entertainment then.
Rgds 
Ken



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-----Original Message-----
From: gasification-bounces at listserv.repp.org
[mailto:gasification-bounces at listserv.repp.org] On Behalf Of Michael Redler
Sent: 19 March 2007 15:03
To: gasification at listserv.repp.org
Subject: Re: [Gasification] Producer Gas Driven Engine w/ Liquid Fuel Assist


Hey Ken, Ken, Tom, List

When I gave the 800 figure, I was going purely by memory and couldn't 
remember how I arrived at this assumption.

So, I went into my archives and found the source:

http://www.green-trust.org/2000/biofuel/makingethanol.htm

If you go to the address, you will notice that the 800 gallons I came up 
with was a misquote and actually refers to average fuel consumption. 
What's interesting is that the actual crop yield claim is 1200 gallons!!

"...a single acre of sugar beats for example would yield about 1200 
gallons of alcohol."

According to your sources Ken, this number (if it has any merit at all) 
must be including more than one harvest per year.

Mike

Ken Basterfield wrote:
> Ken
> Thanks for the link.
> Sugar beet can produce 6-7 tonne of sugar per hectare  at ~ 15%
> sucrose content, so I wasn't that far out.
> Relates to 2.5 tonnes per acre.
> At the 30lb sugar per gallon of ethanol conversion rate it would give 
> only 180 gallons ethanol per acre.
> Deduct the growing and processing costs and the yield will be much 
> less, probably no more that 90 gallons ethanol per acre of beet.
> Ken
>  
>  
>
>
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>     -----Original Message-----
>     *From:* Ken Boak [mailto:kenboak at stirlingservice.freeserve.co.uk]
>     *Sent:* 19 March 2007 09:04
>     *To:* Ken Basterfield; 'Michael Redler';
>     gasification at listserv.repp.org
>     *Subject:* Re: [Gasification] Producer Gas Driven Engine w/ Liquid
>     Fuel Assist
>
>     List,
>      
>     This link shows sugar beet yield per hectare and sugar yields
>      
>     http://www.ienica.net/crops/sugarbeet.htm
>      
>      
>     Many cultivars of sugar beet exist, almost all are capable of
>     giving root yield of 40 tonnes or so per hectare at 15.5 - 18%
>     sugar content, giving 6 -7 tonnes of sugar per hectare.
>      
>     Using Ken's figure for 30lbs sugar to 1 gallon ethanol (US or UK
>     gallon?),   using the lower figure of 6 tonnes per hectare would
>     yield 440 gallons of ethanol per hectare or 178 gallons per acre.
>      
>     With a typical small vehicle returning 30 to 40 miles to the UK
>     gallon,  a maximum of about 6000 to 7000 miles vehicle miles would
>     be possible from an acre of beet.
>      
>     However, beet requires a lot of nitrogen fertiliser to achieve
>     these yields, and then there is the expenditure of fuel and energy
>     used in growing, harvesting and processing the beet into sugar
>     solution.
>      
>     I suspect that running vehicles from ethanol drived from sugar
>     beet would not be economically viable at this stage,  until there
>     is a significant rise in the cost of fossil fuels.
>      
>     It would be an interesting exercise to compare the net potential
>     vehicle miles for an acre of sugarcane,  acre of oilseed rape,
>     soya, sunflower, and short rotation coppiced woods.  Into this
>     equation we need to add the potential for gasifying the crop
>     residues in a gasifier "topping cycle",  sugar cane being
>     particularly attractve because of the large quantities of bagasse
>     produced.
>      
>     I think the picture will be fairly disappointing, suggesting that
>     bio-derived fuels can only ever offer a small percentage offset to
>     fossil fuels, perhaps 10% to 20%, rather than a viable 
> replacement.
>      
>      
>      
>      
>     Ken Boak
>      
>

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