[Gasification] Bulk density and Void fraction of bagasse gasifier

Fri May 4 22:33:22 CDT 2007

Dear Booster Tom Reed,

Any of them tried Bagasse gasification as fixed bed yet?

What will be the actual density, bulk density and void fraction of   Bagasse gasification process?

Any of them working in this bagasse gasification (fixed bed) are invited to render your views.

I request you and all in this bagasse gasification area send me the details of void fraction inside the gasifier.

A. Saravanakumar

>Message: 4
>Date: 4 May 2007 19:30:08 -0000
> From: "A.Saravanakumar" <sara_mnes at rediffmail.com>
>Subject: [Stoves] Bagasse Properties
>To: stoves at listserv.repp.org
>Message-ID: <20070504193008.22240.qmail at webmail10.rediffmail.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain;	charset=iso-8859-1
>
>>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 5
>Date: Fri, 04 May 2007 15:36:39 -0400
> From: "David G. LeVine" <dlevine at speakeasy.net>
>Subject: Re: [Stoves] The PROTOS Plant Oil Cooker
>To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves <stoves at listserv.repp.org>
>Message-ID:
> 	<mailman.2413.1178318969.3071.stoves_listserv.repp.org at listserv.repp.org>
>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
>
>At 09:47 AM 5/4/2007, you wrote:
> >Have you tried Papaya wastes (over ripe papaya fruit -- spoiled
> >papaya) as biodigester food yet??
> >
> >I have been suddenly presented with tons per day -- just for the "taking".
> >
> >Peter/Belize
>
>Peter, Papaya is a fruit with lots of sugar in it, isn't it?  Papaya
>is non-poisonous, isn't it?
>
>Sounds like it might be a worthwhile experiment.
>
>
>David G. LeVine
>Nashua, NH  03060
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 6
>Date: Fri, 04 May 2007 12:45:13 -0700
> From: frank <frank at compostlab.com>
>Subject: Re: [Stoves] Limiting factor for secondary burn?
>To: psanders at ilstu.edu
>Cc: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves <stoves at listserv.repp.org>
>Message-ID: <463B8D49.8090504 at compostlab.com>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed
>
>Paul, Stovers,
>
>I want to separate and optimize the two stages of combustion. So now I
>am working on the primary.
>I need to know what it is I am trying to do.
>
> >
> >
> > It is true that traditional updraft gasifiers do work.  And the
> > gas-producing
> > fire is at the bottom.  But they are burning char at the bottom.  And
> > unless
> > the heat is very great (in order to pyrolyze some of the raw fuel
> > above the hot
> > char), it does not give you usable gases at the top.  And in your very
> > small-size experiment, the pile of raw fuel is (relatively speaking)
> > enormous
> > above the very small bottom fire.
>
>Do they want to burn char at the bottom? or is this necessary to keep
>the fire going?
>
>It seems the goal is to make pure CO from heating carbon materials in
>lack of O2. From my observations in the glass the tars (what ever they
>are) does not turn to CO before being hot enough to volatilize(right ?).
>So tars should not be in the out gas because if they are it becomes
>'dirty' fuel(right ?). In fact tars do not seem to burn very well in the
>secondary burn because they coat stove pipes  and cause health problems
>(?).
>
>
>
> >
> > Please note that so many many fires and stove configurations are lit
> > at the
> > bottom.  Bottom lighting is NOT the single criteria for making a
> > gasifier, even
> > if you confine the fuel into a glass tube.
> >
>I (via my company Chip Energy) do have an bottom-fired updraft gasifier
>(see
>
> > http://www.chipenergy.com/furnace.htm ).  But it, even with its larger
> > size and
> > high-heat of operation, cannot be ignited in the way that you are
> > trying to do
> > your small-scale experiment.
> >
> > If your white gases are actually a cloud of water vapor (which I
> > expect they
> > are), they will never ignite.
> >
>I don't know what the white vapors are but they do not seem like water.
>The wood is very dry so it would be the water produced during the burn
>if it is water.
>With labs going from Atomic Absorption (AA) to ICP to measure metals
>there are a lot of AA's in the graveyards of equipment. We just dumped a
>few and I am sure Universities must have some.  The AA has an atomizer
>below the burner that, via a gas flow and venturi effect, takes a stream
>of water and smashes against a small ball (~6mm) and turns it into a
>cloud of water mist. I have saved one of these and think they would be
>very useful when doing water effects on burns. If I can get this system
>to work that is one of many experiments I would like to do.
>
>
> > You mention that "understanding woodgas" is your motivation.  So I do
> > not know
> > how you got onto the track that you are following.  Tom Reed has done
> > the TLUD
> > woodgas experiment in glass tubes, but he lights it at the top.  That
> > is a way
> > to understand woodgas creation and combustion.
> >
>Everything I have done I am sure has been done a million times and I do
>not want to spend time to re-invent the wheel. That is why I am asking
>all these questions and I appreciate your help. Next experiment I will
>try a TLDD perhaps using the cardboard or some type of starter. I can
>send the larger tube down to the bottom to capture the out gas. Thinking
>about this I like it because it seems there will be more control when
>making the burn go down (you can slow or speed it up) and there will be
>less chance of unburned air going past the burn because the burn will
>take the air out of an air space above it.
>
>
>Thanks
>Frank
>
>
>
>
> > Paul
> >
> > Quoting frank <frank at compostlab.com>:
> >
> >> Dear Paul,
> >>
> >> I got a chance to try a few more runs using cardboard as a starter
> >> and very dry wood chips (< 2 cm) for the fuel
> >> .
> >> I find the O2 is hard to get to 0 as Crispin suggested without the
> >> burn (glow) going out. I think the problem is that I have a flat
> >> cross section of burn and if it is not completely burning across the
> >> horizontal some un-used air goes past. I am thinking I need to funnel
> >> down the location of the burn so all the air passes through the glow.
> >> I am thinking I will need a weak spring pushing on a perforated plate
> >> to make sure the fuel is pushed to the bottom as it is being used up
> >> where the burn is.
> >>
> >> As I said before the top of the glass '1/2 stove' is just warm and
> >> the gases are room temperature and white. Will these gases at room
> >> temperature ignite? Or do they need to be close to the primary burn
> >> and hot?
> >>
> >> I am thinking I have a BLUD wood gas producing unite. I have left out
> >> the secondary burn  and hope to get to that when I get the primary
> >> burn adjusted to do what (I think) it should. Is this what i am doing??
> >>
> >> Thanks
> >> Frank
> >>
> >
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------
> > This message was sent using Illinois State University Webmail.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>--
>Frank Shields
>Soil Control Lab
>42 Hangar way
>Watsonville, CA  95076
>(831) 724-5422 tel
>(831) 724-3188 fax
>frank at compostlab.com
>www.compostlab.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 7
>Date: Fri, 04 May 2007 16:44:50 -0400
> From: "David G. LeVine" <dlevine at speakeasy.net>
>Subject: Re: [Stoves] The PROTOS Plant Oil Cooker
>To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves <stoves at listserv.repp.org>
>Message-ID:
> 	<mailman.2414.1178318969.3071.stoves_listserv.repp.org at listserv.repp.org>
>
>Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
>
>At 12:26 PM 5/4/2007, you wrote:
> >OK -- people on these lists absolutely abhor "discussions" that deal with
> >realities -- in the field -- so to speak.
> >
> >So I will shut up and butt out.
> >
> >Two oil plants are being highly promoted in Belize and Guatemala these days.
>
>I have seen fanatics and they are truly amazing in their
>unwillingness to face facts.
>
>
>David G. LeVine
>Nashua, NH  03060
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 8
>Date: Fri, 4 May 2007 17:26:57 -0400 (EDT)
> From: "Jeff Davis" <jeff0124 at velocity.net>
>Subject: Re: [Stoves] Used cooking oils
>To: "Discussion of biomass cooking stoves" <stoves at listserv.repp.org>
>Message-ID: <36371.152.50.3.3.1178314017.squirrel at www.velocity.net>
>Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
>
>Dr Karve wrote:
> > This is a method used by many farmers to clean and reuse lubricating oil
> > from the sump of a tractor.
>
>Thank you for this method! I've thinking about re-using oil also.
>
>
>Thanks again,
>
>Jeff
>
>
>
>
>
>--
>Jeff Davis
>
>Some where 20 miles south of Lake Erie, USA
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
>Message: 9
>Date: Fri, 4 May 2007 15:49:18 -0700
> From: "Tom Miles" <tmiles at trmiles.com>
>Subject: Re: [Stoves] Used cooking oils
>To: "'Discussion of biomass cooking stoves'"
> 	<stoves at listserv.repp.org>
>Message-ID: <000701c78e9e$7370ae90$5a520bb0$@com>
>Content-Type: text/plain;	charset="us-ascii"
>
>This must be what they used to call the "Indian rope trick."
>
>Tom
>
>-----Original Message-----
> From: stoves-bounces at listserv.repp.org
>[mailto:stoves-bounces at listserv.repp.org] On Behalf Of Jeff Davis
>Sent: Friday, May 04, 2007 2:27 PM
>To: Discussion of biomass cooking stoves
>Subject: Re: [Stoves] Used cooking oils
>
>Dr Karve wrote:
> > This is a method used by many farmers to clean and reuse lubricating oil
> > from the sump of a tractor.
>
>Thank you for this method! I've thinking about re-using oil also.
>
>
>Thanks again,
>
>Jeff
>
>
>
>
>
>--
>Jeff Davis
>
>Some where 20 miles south of Lake Erie, USA
>
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>
>
>
>
>
>------------------------------
>
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>End of Stoves Digest, Vol 11, Issue 14
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