[Gasification] who killed the electric car?

Tue Apr 8 13:07:53 CDT 2008

Greg 

In the movie, most people wanted to buy their cars back in California. In
florida they already use electric golfcarts for local trip. I think an
electric vehicle for most could be be a great second vehicle for local trips
where much of your mileage is done. Most people don't live in severe winter
climates.

If you look at the cost per km or mile, a light electric vehicle is pretty
interesting option as is a biogas fuelled vehicle. I think if we never had a
liquid fossil fuel energy dowry we would be moving mainly on electricity or
biogas in temperate climates. If you look at the energy conversion
efficiency of cellulosic ethanol you are looking at 340 litres per tonne
(according to the Iogen web site). That's a conversion efficiency of 1 tonne
of biomass into 7.13 GJ of energy or about 40%. Instead you could gasify the
biomass to produce heat and power at 85% efficiency and avoid spending
350-500 million on a cellulosic ethanol plant.  To me it's a much better
option and unlike cellulose ethanol is ready to go. If we are at peak oil as
many are now discussing (and Shell is paying for advertisements about the
problem of peak oil), it's the best substitute option we have. 

Roger Samson

Executive Director

REAP-Canada

Box 125 Centennial Centre CCB13

Ste. Anne de Bellevue, QC H9X 3V9

T: (514) 398-7743

T: (514) 398-7972

E: rsamson at reap-canada.com

W: www.reap-canada.com 

-----Original Message-----
From: gasification-bounces at listserv.repp.org
[mailto:gasification-bounces at listserv.repp.org] On Behalf Of Greg and April
Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 11:28 AM
To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification
Subject: Re: [Gasification] Gallon Newsletter overviews Biofuels and
BillC-33

Roger,

It wasn't just ethanol that killed the electric car, it was performance when

off the test track ( in mild climates ) into the real world that also had a 
major impact.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not a fan of ethanol ( I think butanol is the way to

go my self ), but performance in winter weather and performance in hill 
country ( or worse yet hill country in cold weather ), makes even ethanol a 
better choice than batteries.

In weather below 32* ( and more so below zero ) the batteries have major 
problems, and small electric generators just don't have the capacity to over

come it.    When the Prius was first released and then sold in Denver CO, 
quite a few were bought so people could efficiently commute into Denver, 
from outlying areas.

That first winter, a full 10-15% of all towing calls were from Prius owners,

that were stuck, because the cold weather drained their batteries, and the 
small generator wasn't big enough to keep the vehicle moving at more than a 
snails pace.

Few Prius were sold the following year - and there was a surge in Prius 
trade-in's for vehicles with conventional engines.

Greg H.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Roger Samson" <rsamson at reap-canada.com>
To: "'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification'" 
<gasification at listserv.repp.org>
Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2008 7:52
Subject: [Gasification] Gallon Newsletter overviews Biofuels and Bill C-33

>
>
>
>
> The gallon newsletter is the most widely read environment newsletter from
> Canada which summarizes leading environmental news stories
>
> http://www.cialgroup.com/gallonletter.html
>
> Here is their recent summary Vol. 13, No. 3, April 7, 2008 on Biofuels and
> Bill C-33
>
> roger
>
> ps. Everybody should watch the movie :'who killed the electric car" and 
> all
> you gasification fans should promote electric cars instead of ethanol 
> (grain
> or cellulose) as a better option
>
>
>
> BIOFUELS AND BILL C-33
>
>
>
> Canada's Parliament is reviewing Bill C-33 to develop new renewable fuels
> regulations through amendments of the Canadian Environmental Protection 
> Act
> CEPA. The regulations are intended to:
>
> * Reduce greenhouse gas emissions by 4 megatonnes per year in the
> transportation sector and to
> * Benefit Canadian agriculture by boosting demand for feedstocks and
> creating new markets for agricultural products.
>
> The regulations will require minimum renewable fuel content of 5% or more 
> in
> gasoline and 2% in diesel and heating oil by 2012.
>
>
>
> REAP: Direct Heat from Pellets
>
>
>
> Making a presentation to the House of Commons Standing Committee on
> Agriculture and Agri-food on February 28 was Roger Samson, Executive
> Director of REAP (Resource Efficient Agricultural Production) Canada based
> on a 2008 study REAP conducted in association with BIOCAP Canada 
> Foundation.
> The study is called Analysing Ontario Biofuel options: Greenhouse Gas
> Mitigation Efficiency and Costs.
>
>
>
> Samson provided a lifecycle GHG emissions for bioenergy which indicated 
> that
> Canadian corn ethanol, soybean or canola biodiesel have the highest GHG
> emissions compared to electrical power generation from renewable sources
> such as manure and straw pellets. Electricity from wind power has the 
> lowest
> GHG emissions but close are heating directly with geothermal, switchgrass
> pellets, and solar. The lifecycle analysis is highly dependent on
> assumptions and available data and the report recommends better accounting
> systems. For example, some studies do not account for carbon-rich forests
> and grasslands converted to croplands with a net loss of carbon storage.
> While governments provide incentives for green power and liquid biofuels,
> there are few support programs for green heat.
>
>
>
> Issues raised by the proposed regulations are identified as:
>
> * Conversion of grasslands which store carbon into annual crops which
> could "present a substantial risk to the global carbon cycle."
> * Canada already imports 2 million tonnes of corn per year. Surplus
> land for crop production doesn't exist so the regulations would benefit
> out-of-country farmers as imports for both feed for livestock and for
> ethanol will have to increase.
> * Ethanol producers use natural gas which may have to be imported
> within the next two decades according to the National Energy Board.
> * Cellulosic ethanol may not be cost competitive because it is
> inefficient to produce (a large amount of biomass is needed with only a 
> 39%
> conversion efficiency) and capital intensive.
> * Pellet plants in contrast convert almost all of the biomass to solid
> fuel pellets, a proven technology, at a fraction of the cost of the 
> capital
> cost of cellulosic ethanol plants, still not commercially viable.
> * Biodiesel from animal fats, waste vegetable oils and off-spec feed
> grains benefit both the economy and the environment but biodiesel from 
> seed
> oil crops is too expensive.
>
> REAP recommends that the bill be withdrawn because:
>
> 1. It cannot achieve the 4 megatonnes of CO2 emission reduction.
>
> 2. It will benefit US corn growers.
>
> 3. It lacks fiscal responsibility. CO2 offsets from corn are 6-10 times 
> more
> expensive than other renewable energy sources.
>
>
>
> Instead REAP recommends:
>
> * A results-based policy framework to ensure effective carbon offset
> efficiencies and high energy output per hectare.
> * Move towards perennial crops rather than using annual food crops as
> fuel which will lead to land conversion of natural areas, food inflation 
> and
> to global food insecurity.
> * The government should not pick winners but apply incentives using
> marketplace principles. A $25/tonne carbon tax and a $25/tonne green 
> carbon
> incentive would ensure parity among all the renewable energy players, 
> reduce
> impacts on fossil fuel energy users and provide incentives to switch to
> green carbon sources.
>
>
>
>
>
> Roger Samson
>
> Executive Director
>
> REAP-Canada
>
> Box 125 Centennial Centre CCB13
>
> Ste. Anne de Bellevue, QC H9X 3V9
>
> T: (514) 398-7743
>
> T: (514) 398-7972
>
> E:  <mailto:rsamson at reap-canada.com> rsamson at reap-canada.com
>
> W:  <http://www.reap-canada.com/> www.reap-canada.com
>
>
>
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