[Gasification] Biogas from Pasture and second gen and GTL

[mark crorey]

What is the design of the gasifier?

-----Original Message-----
From: gasification-bounces at listserv.repp.org
[mailto:gasification-bounces at listserv.repp.org] On Behalf Of Winfried
Rijssenbeek
Sent: Friday, April 11, 2008 3:21 PM
To: 'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification'
Subject: [Gasification] Biogas from Pasture and second gen and GTL

Roger, and others interesting Biogas from pasture

Indeed we plan to do a trial with one ha of improved tropical pastur,
yielding 30 TM/ha/yr. We will have to cut 9 to 10 times/annum. We plan to
use the biogas (plug flow reactor) for a simple gas engine generator. The
nutrients leaving the digestor are fed back to the land. It is to my
understanding as good as the so called 2 gen biofuels! For Honduras we
calculated that 12 families could live of 1 ha with per family 0.8 KW for 8
hours!!! What I would find interesting is if the biogas (polluted CH4) can
also be brought to a syndiesel (Shell uses GTL on large scale, but can it be
done on small scale ? Is it feasible? If so then all energy carriers
(electricity gas for cooking and fuel for cars could be made from pasture.
Seems great to me!

Wonder if any of you guys would know?

Winfried Rijssenbeek 


-----Original Message-----
From: gasification-bounces at listserv.repp.org
[mailto:gasification-bounces at listserv.repp.org] On Behalf Of Roger Samson
Sent: vrijdag 11 april 2008 20:48
To: 'Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification'
Subject: Re: [Gasification] biogas vehicle

Harmon 

Our agency promotes native perennial grasses on marginal lands as the most
sustainable energy crop feedstock option. If you don't like the fact you
don't get food from the corn silage biogas just grow half as much and the
other half in food corn. That way you get both a larger net energy gain and
more food calories than the corn ethanol option on the same area. You do the
math. 

The more sustainable option is just grow perennials grass for heat (and CHP)
and energy grass and manure for biogas in temperate regions.  


Roger Samson

Executive Director

REAP-Canada

Box 125 Centennial Centre CCB13

Ste. Anne de Bellevue, QC H9X 3V9

T: (514) 398-7743

T: (514) 398-7972

E: rsamson at reap-canada.com

W: www.reap-canada.com 

-----Original Message-----
From: gasification-bounces at listserv.repp.org
[mailto:gasification-bounces at listserv.repp.org] On Behalf Of Harmon Seaver
Sent: Friday, April 11, 2008 12:40 AM
To: Discussion of biomass pyrolysis and gasification
Subject: Re: [Gasification] biogas vehicle

Roger Samson wrote:
> Kevin 
> 
> We have a paper coming out soon on the energy balances of the main
> alternatives.  
> 
> Roughly you can get about 6500 m3 (150 GJ) of biogas from 1 ha of corn
> silage. With corn ethanol you get about 3500 l/ha (about 72 GJ). Roughly
you
> capture twice as much energy from farmland by using biogas as the energy
> carrier. 

   There is a very, very serious and major error in this calculation.
When you make the feedstock into ethanol, you have just as much food
left, and, in fact, much higher quality, much more digestible food left
over, in the form of the spent mash. So you are producing both food and
fuel.
   When you use the same feedstock to make methane, you might get more
fuel, but you get no food at all. And the fuel you get is highly
inferior to ethanol as a vehicle fuel simple because it requires much
greater modification of the vehicle and it is impossible to carry enough
methane to go very far.
   Plus, of course, the fact that corn is a horrible feedstock for
ethanol or methane, you can find a great many feedstocks that will give
you two, three, even four times as much ethanol as corn, and that can be
grown in sustainable, permaculture fashion -- plant once, never again,
no fertilizer or herbicides needed.
   Building smaller neighborhood or farm-scale ethanol plants as the
basis for permaculture operations is the way of the future. Digesters
making methane can and should be a part of that operation, especially
for the manure from the livestock you feed the spent mash to, and also
feed with the light stillage drained from the mash after distillation.


-- 
Harmon Seaver

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