[Greenbuilding] [BULK] Re: Tankless Water Heaters

[Dr. C.F. Vasile]

You're right, "Gas demand is not really a problem for gas suppliers". 
Neverthless, page 7 of DOE's a 4 April 2003 Report entitled "ENERGY STAR ® 
Labeling
Potential for Water Heaters" warns:

"Gas instantaneous water heaters will place a much greater demand on the gas 
supply line.
Consumers should consult an expert when installing these products, 
especially in older homes to
ensure that the gas infrastructure can support the application of such water 
heaters. Local gas
utilities may be able to help consumers with installation. Consequently, DOE 
could limit
ENERGY STAR criteria to gas instantaneous water heaters being used in new 
construction.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Lawrence Lile" <LLile at projsolco.com>
Cc: <greenbuilding at listserv.repp.org>
Sent: Friday, December 22, 2006 8:12 AM
Subject: Re: [Greenbuilding] [BULK] Re: Tankless Water Heaters


> Gas demand is not really a problem for gas suppliers.  Electric demand is 
> a problem, but in the grand scheme of things, a 20KW water heater is not a 
> really big load.  There is probably a chiller in the local hospital that 
> wastes more than 20KW just idling. Utilities pay more moeny to buy 
> electricity at peak demand times, usually in air conditioning peaks. 
> Demand is a management issue for the utility, but has nothing to do with 
> energy savings.  That's why it's a phony argument.
>
>
> Electricity as a fuel is considered less desireable than gas, because of 
> the inefficiency of producing electricity from heat, then transporting it 
> long distances, then turning it back into heat.  You get about 40% of the 
> energy back.  If you burn gas directly, you've created the heat where it 
> is needed, and on a coal fired utility you've created less carbon in the 
> process.  Historically, gas appliances were cheaper to run than electric, 
> but that is changing as
> energy fluctuates.  That being said, an electric tankless is a great 
> problem solver in the right application.
>
> I wish Dr. Vasile well in his crusade to make the DOE start thinking 
> rationally!
>
> Lawrence Lile, PE, LEED AP
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: greenbuilding-bounces at listserv.repp.org on behalf of Reuben Deumling
> Sent: Thu 12/21/2006 11:36 AM
> To: Dr. C.F. Vasile
> Cc: greenbuilding at listserv.repp.org; Nick Pine
> Subject: [BULK] Re: [Greenbuilding] Tankless Water Heaters
>
>
>
> I certainly am not privy to the negotiations with and within the DOE in
> relation to tankless water heaters, but the idea that at higher 
> saturations
> they (electric and gas tankless water heaters) could increase morning and
> evening peaks seems plausible. Why do you consider them 'phony arguments'?
> Reuben Deumling
>
> On 12/21/06, Dr. C.F. Vasile <gfx-ch at msn.com> wrote:
>>
>> If only that were true. One of the reasons given against tankless gas
>> heaters was that they would increase the peak demand on gas pipelines --
>> which is totally false. They used the same phony argument against 
>> tankless
>> electric heaters.
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Nick Pine" <nick at early.com>
>> To: <greenbuilding at listserv.repp.org>
>> Sent: Wednesday, December 20, 2006 8:51 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Greenbuilding] Tankless Water Heaters
>>
>
>
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