[Greenbuilding] Hot water return

Shawna Henderson shawna at abridesign.com
Wed Feb 4 05:52:26 CST 2009 

Thanks for the info on the Metlund units all, and thanx to Mark for de- 
lurking himself and adding the BG info into the dialogue. It's so  
helpful to get a big picture view of things.

BTW, can anyone help me find a Canadian supplier of Metlund D'Mand  
units? So far, I've come up with blank and nothing from a request from  
the supplier that I made on Monday.

Thanks


Shawna Henderson
CEO, Bfreehomes Design Ltd.
www.bfreehomes.com
1.902.489.1014



On 3-Feb-09, at 11:32 PM, Jason Holstine wrote:

> Indeed, the Metlund D'Mands are quite effective, esp given their  
> simplicity.
> You can get a motion detector to turn it on when you walk in the  
> room if you
> care to automate it a little.
>
> Mark - don't even think of ducking back to lurk mode. I've often  
> wanted to
> post bg stories but haven't in respect to the subscription service and
> copyrights. It's beyond valuable information.
>
> Jason Holstine
> Amicus Green Building Center
> www.amicusgreen.com
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: greenbuilding-bounces at listserv.repp.org
> [mailto:greenbuilding-bounces at listserv.repp.org] On Behalf Of Mark  
> Piepkorn
> Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 10:02 PM
> To: Greenbuilding at listserv.repp.org
> Subject: Re: [Greenbuilding] Hot water return
>
>
>         Demand-Controlled Hot Water Circulators:
> http://www.buildinggreen.com/auth/article.cfm/2008/2/3/Water-Doing-More-With
> -Less/#Demand-ControlledHotWaterCirculators
>
> At 08:49 PM 2/3/2009, Gennaro Brooks-Church wrote:
>> I found this very good article on return lines and circulators.
>> http://www.waterrating.gov.au/publications/pubs/hot-water-circulators.p
>> df
>>
>> Although it does say that on demand re circulators are good, they  
>> only
>> work really well when they are manual. Meaning they need to be
>> activated by a switch (in the bathroom for example). Sounds way too
>> complicated.
>
>         That's the reason I can't stay up after it gets dark - them
> light-switcher-onners are just too much for me to figure
> out.   :)   Seriously, pushing a button to activate a
> temperature-sensing recirculator is less complicated than sticking  
> your
> finger in the stream every few seconds to see if the water's hot yet.
>
>> I've basically concluded that in terms of energy conservation it  
>> isn't
>> worth having a hot water return. The water saved does not warrant the
>> energy wasted (in hot water, up front costs and electricity). For
>> comfort of course it is good but not for energy savings.
>
>         We all rest our pointy heads on solipsistic pillows of our own
> experience. I grew up in Minnesota and live in Vermont, so I always  
> default
> to thinking about nice juicy heating climates full of lakes and  
> streams and
> with frequent rain and snow (despite a couple odd years in New  
> Mexico). From
> a 1995 - yes, FOURTEEN YEARS ago - review in EBN of Metlund's on- 
> demand
> recirc system: "The potential water savings from recirculating  
> systems is so
> dramatic that many municipalities, particularly in drought-stricken
> California, now require such systems in new homes. Depending on the
> assumptions chosen, a full-time recirculating system can use about  
> 900 kWh
> (more than a full-size refrigerator) and waste 9 million Btu (9,500
> megajoules) annually in heat loss from pipes."
> http://www.buildinggreen.com/auth/article.cfm/1995/3/1/Hot-Water-on-Demand-A
> nd-No-Energy-Penalty/
>
>         For more on the state of water and our relationships with  
> it, see
> these three recent EBN features:
>
> Water: Doing More With Less (February 1, 2008)
> http://www.buildinggreen.com/auth/article.cfm/2008/2/3/Water-Doing-More-With
> -Less/
>
> Alternative Water Sources: Supply-Side Solutions for Green Buildings  
> (May 1,
> 2008)
> http://www.buildinggreen.com/auth/article.cfm/2008/4/29/Alternative-Water-So
> urces-Supply-Side-Solutions-for-Green-Buildings/
>
> Water Policies: Encouraging Conservation (September 1, 2008)
> http://www.buildinggreen.com/auth/article.cfm/2008/8/28/Water-Policies-Encou
> raging-Conservation/
>
>
>         Am I aggravating people by posting all this BuildingGreen  
> stuff
> lately, or is it helpful? I do work there, after all, and there are  
> people
> on this list wise enough to keep abreast of the information  
> available there
> on their own. On the other hand, BuildingGreen does the day-to-day
> maintenance of this list as a public service (REPP.org is the actual
> listowner), so some license might have been earned. Whatever. I'll  
> probably
> duck back into lurk mode anyway - as enjoyable as it can sometimes be,
> active forum participation takes more time than I usually have.
>
>
> Mark
>
>
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